Recco - Anyone got any 1st hand experience?

I was just wondering if anyone had ever been involved either in being rescued or rescuing anyone else where a Recco helped?

I find myself religiously ensuring that I always have one either in my clothing or on my boots, but was struck by a thought that I hadn't ever met anyone who could say how well they work.

I should mention that I don't have any relationship with Recco and am asking from personal curiosity.

Happy digging,

Jan

Jan,

I also am a "neophyte" in the technical aspects of this unit.

What little I know is that there are two major types of "locater" units.

The ones you are referring to, and that you see more and more in ski jackets ( Spyder) and boots are passive units! They act like mirrors reflecting "sound waves" from units rescuers have! My Atomic boots have such units at the rear cuff!

The other units (and more effective) are units which "beam" out pulses which can be localized! In my Spyder Jacket in the top left sleeve I have a small pocket which allows a Ipod size unit to be inseted!

I am not sure if there is a standard wavelength for all units world wide! Allow me to check!

I know that all serious heli-ski tours I have taken , we were given top of the line units with a range well over 200 meters! In my country it is mandatory to wear such units if you do nay "back-country" skiing!

I do not think it is necessary to wear such units in most ski resorts! Better is the small radio/phone units you can get at any audio shops. Saved my life once in a large large ski resort!

could be wrong but im led to believe the recco units are not worth a great deal as the locator units are only stored in a few places round resorts. so someone who witnessed the slide has to go and find a person in authority who then sends a team out. when time is of the essence... myself and the group i ski with all use tranceivers which always give off a signal but if one of group gets caught, the rest switch to search and start immediatlly. never had to use one in anger, but in practice never takes more than a couple of mins.these are only any good however if all in your group wear one, know how to use it and carry shovels and probes. if you only ski on piste, really dont need it, but if you go off, is essential, and peace of mind.i also carry a recco, cant hurt to...

Jan I Stenmark wrote:I was just wondering if anyone had ever been involved either in being rescued or rescuing anyone else where a Recco helped?

As they weigh practically nothing and cost about the same there's no strong reason not to have them. It's just a copper coil with a transponder and a diode basically but it's actually highly accurate, as it's not transmitting a detector will go straight to a transponder without traversing flux lines as in a transceiver search. It's a passive system and doesn't interfere with anything else. The typical use is from helicopters and the detectors can pinpoint other devices like phones, radios or transceivers even if they're turned off.

In terms of a primary system it's not so good, a lot of ski stations do have detectors but getting them or a helicopter on scene takes too long for them to be useful. Here in Switzerland the main rescue helicopters, Air Glaciers, REGA and Air Zermatt have detectors as do the PGHM in France.

The chances of being found with a RECCO are fairly remote, in the last few years in Switzerland I think there's only been one recovery (deceased) made with a RECCO out of about 100 and that was in Zermatt. I'm not even sure why RECCO was deployed for that incident, the recovery was 23mins at 140cm which suggests it was near a detector cache or Air Zermatt were in the air very quick and that the skiers weren't equipped with transceivers. In terms of overall effectiveness I'm not sure there's any systematic data collection especially for live recoveries, but, I'd think the live recovery number is vanishingly low.

There's an argument that placing them in jackets and on gear puts them into groups that wouldn't typically have any active detection but it's a poor argument at best and not helped by a lack of recorded live recoveries.

Jan I Stenmark wrote:
I find myself religiously ensuring that I always have one either in my clothing or on my boots, but was struck by a thought that I hadn't ever met anyone who could say how well they work.

It's worth bearing in mind if you decide to use RECCO's then you'll need more than one, the signal can be blocked by the body so having them on both sleeves and boots is a good configuration.

Do I have them? No, I had to pause and think if any had snuck onto jackets etc and they've not and if someone gave me a handful I'd probably not put them. I'm fairly ambivalent if it's a dog or RECCO that recovers my frozen body, I'd go for the dog on balance, I think there should be more dogs for SAR work.

What do I carry though? In order of likelihood :

A tracker DTS transceiver
G3 Avitech shovel
G3 speed pro 240cm probe
slope meter
G3 bone saw
G3 rutsch block cord
thermometer
crystal card magnifying glass
EITHER avalung
OR abs sack

Anyone off piste should have the first three items minimum and know how to use them of course.

Pavelski wrote:
In my Spyder Jacket in the top left sleeve I have a small pocket which allows a Ipod size unit to be inseted!

That'll be for an ipod or phone. You would not put a transceiver in a pocket like that.

Pavelski wrote:I know that all serious heli-ski tours I have taken , we were given top of the line units with a range well over 200 meters! In my country it is mandatory to wear such units if you do nay "back-country" skiing!

I do not think it is necessary to wear such units in most ski resorts! Better is the small radio/phone units you can get at any audio shops. Saved my life once in a large large ski resort!

First, you're talking transceivers, there's no transceiver on the marker with a range of 200m, you may be using the wrong units and mean 200 feet which is more realistic.

Second, it's not mandatory to wear transceivers anywhere to my knowledge even in the US. There are out of bounds areas with gated access tripped by a transceiver signal or with test zones on the gates. It's just strongly advised.

Third, you need to understand not everyone's in the US or skis there. US stations have avalanche controlled off-piste inside the station boundaries, that's not generally the case in Europe although exceptions would be any itinerary and specific areas like the SPOT in Tignes and our Freeride area in Zinal. It is common practice in the US not to carry transceiver/probe/shovel when skiing lift served off-piste as it's controlled, that's not the case in Europe (see above exceptions) and anyone skiing off-piste needs to carry minimally transceiver/probe/shovel and be proficient in their use.

Finally, phones are useful but can't be used in combination with transceivers, the transceiver signal is deflected by the phone.

I would be more tempted to buy a jacketetc with a recco reflector but am unaware of what it does? It seems to give me piece of mind!

Rossfra8 wrote:I would be more tempted to buy a jacketetc with a recco reflector but am unaware of what it does? It seems to give me piece of mind!

:oops: long posts are horrible I know, but I think I just described this.

If you want the executive summary, RECCO detectors are great for recovering bodies. There's practically no recorded live recoveries.

ise wrote:
First, you're talking transceivers, there's no transceiver on the marker with a range of 200m, you may be using the wrong units and mean 200 feet which is more realistic.

technical correction... it's just struck me that the helicopter mounted receivers with the dish at the front of the heli' may receive at that distance. So, technically we are transmitting a fair way but the receive range of a hand unit is lower, say 40-60m approx

ise wrote:

Finally, phones are useful but can't be used in combination with transceivers, the transceiver signal is deflected by the phone.

I had my doubts about this deflection issue. Then I saw your Tracker being deflected from the signal my Ortovox F1 was transmitting, by the two mobile phones I was carrying.
Next time we must check out if the F1 suffers the same way.