Latest posts for the topic "Winter Tyres and Chains"

Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 08:40:52 GMT

We have a thread on this topic every year. So I thought I'd get in early. Plus now is the time to be thinking about ordering your winter tyres - they're manufactured during the summer and the stock is finite, so by mid-winter stocks can be low/empty. Rather than the usual comments, I thought that I'd write a narrative:
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You're driving along a French road on the way to skiing in the Alps. Outside, the temperature is around 0oC to -2oC and the skies are grey. "We're fine - the snow chains are in the boot, so we're prepared. And we're front-wheel drive anyway." you say. But you are already at a disadvantage against the French and German cars around you. They have their winter tyres on and you're on the summer tyres fitted as standard to all British cars. This means that when you brake, you'll take 20%-25% more distance before you come to a stop, even on tarmac.

Now it starts to snow and after a while you're driving through patches where you're alternating between tarmac and snow. But you can't stop easily and anyway, the chains aren't suited to this. "If it gets heavier, I'll put the chains on - but no one else is, so let's see. I can't keep putting them on and taking them off." The car starts to slide a bit on the snowy patches and you slow down to compensate, but everyone else seems to be coping fine. That 25% difference in stopping distance is now more like x2-x3 but it's not obvious. And there's a queue building up behind you. "Can't these people see it's snowing?" In fact they can, and since this is a regular winter situation, that's why they have their winter tyres on. They don't need to slow down until the conditions are much worse. And it looks like they're behind a typical English driver who seems to think that having chains solves everything.

Snow now covers the road, but it's not that deep and you're debating whether to stop and put the chains on when you approach a corner and slight incline. Each car ahead happily takes the corner at 50Kms/hr but when you do the car slides alarmingly. You just about keep it on the road but halfway up the incline (it can hardly be called a hill) you gently glide to a halt, skewed slightly into oncoming traffic, the wheels spinning. Further back in the queue, another English car coasts gracefully into the rear of a French delivery van and at the corner, a similarly unprepared young Dutch driver pitches quietly into the ditch.

Your chains are still in the boot.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 09:16:28 GMT

There's a thread going on over on Snowheads at the moment around winter tyres, with an actual expert on the subject (shock horror)!

If anyone has specific questions on winter tyres, or general advice, that would be a good place to ask them.

http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=91733

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 09:57:05 GMT

We run our Uk based car on winter tyres every season so I can speak from a personal perspective. Winter tyres can make a huge difference. We swap over in November and keep them on until around March/April.

With relatively fresh rubber the grip is excellent in snow and it is possible to drive along at 40 to 50 mph without any problems at all (on the straight bits, not corners!!). I did get very frustrated though during the recent bad winters with cars ahead of me driving at 10 mph! People do seem to get annoyed when you overtake them...

We have taken the car over to Norway twice, once at Christmas with temperatures as low as -25. I was able to drive along safely without holding up the local traffic (who are all driving on studded tyres - no real sign of chains in Norway, other than on Belgian and Dutch vehicles)

Word of warning about tread depth - once you are down to approx 4mm a lot of the grip has gone (compared to 1.6mm minimum for tyres generally).

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 12:35:03 GMT

I cannot endorse this enough. I ruin one of my cars on winter tyres November to March in the UK so that I have a car to use in any event. I dont run them on the Merc as its RWD and automatic which means it turns into a dodgem car as soon as it snows irrespective of what tyres its got.

For driving abroad, many countries now make it legal to have winter tyres and you can be fined for not having them.

Buy a cheap set of wheels and put winter tyres on them so you can swap and change according to weather, as its never cold enough here for a sustained period to warrant having them on full time through winter. And they'll wear out fast as soon as its goes above 5c. Plus it will save your alloys getting covered in grit and salt.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 13:22:10 GMT

We also have an automatic Merc.

How would one get round the fact that winter tyres are pointless if the law says you have to have them?

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:43:27 GMT

Hi Folks,

Sorry not been about much lately....work calls unfortunately....heres a reply I posted on another forum with regards to winter tyres etc....

Sorry I am little late to this trhead as I've only just registered on the site, with regards to Winter Tyres the main misconception is that people think " they are only for snow aren't they "....well the answer is no.....

....normal tyres have a harder silica/rubber compound which once the temperature falls below 7 oC ( 44.6 F ) starts to harden up and be less pliable, and therefore lose traction/grip ( in wet/damp,cold,ice/snow conditions ).

Winter tyres ( proper winter tyres will have a snowflake+mountain symbol on the side wall of the tyre ) have a different silica/rubber combination which keeps the tryre grippy from 7oC to around -30oC dependent on make etc, also the grooves and tread on the outside of the tyre (sipes) are deeper and bigger, typical tread depth on a winter tyre for cars is 10mm - 12mm, it is the ability to hold snow in these sipes that makes the tyre grip.....think of when you make a snowball with wooly gloves and how the snowball sticks to the glove.

With respect to how many tyres, winter tyres should be fitted to ALL 4 tyres, as one of the main things a winter tyres will do is under breaking make the car brake in a straight line, if tyres are only fitted to the driven wheels, the other end of the car will become like a peendulum and put the car into a sideways spin....not good.

There are many good makes of winter tyres but after driving in the French Alps for over 20 years I would recommend Continental , Vredstein and Nokian as probably the best ......Continental's winter tyres are regularly voted top choice in the German equivalent of the AA's tyres tests.

I drive a Vauxhall Astra 1.7diesel and will be buying a set of the Continental winter tyres at the end of the month ( a good site to buy from is http://www.mytyres.co.uk ) sorry about the long link folks.

As for do winter tyresd wear out quicker again no more than normal tyres, a set fitted at the end of October and changed back mid march or when the temps start to avarage 9oC - 10oC in the morning and evening rush hour should last 3 - 4 winters on average mileage.

As for snow socks and chains......chains are brilliant in the event of exceptionally bad roads ( with winter tyres ) and make a world of difference when used with just normal tyres, the only problem is that they should be removed when the road has no snow as driving on tarmac with chaains will not only destroy your tyres but will do damage to the road surface, also chaains are only good for up to 20 - 25Mph maximum, if you do buy chains RUUD are about the best about at quite a fair price ( dependant on size of tyre etc ), also make sure you practice putting them on before the weather is bad as doing it for the first time in freezing cold , snowy conditions isn't fun ( a pair of gloves kept in the car and a piece of plastic sheeting to lay on would be a good idea as well ).

Snowsocks are okay ish but have very limited areas of use , to be honest....a set of winter tyres backed up with snowchains is more than you should need, also a plastic shovel in the boot is a good idea .

I hope some of this is helpful and informative and welcome comments on anything I've missed or can help with.

Again I hope this helps.

All the best

jon.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:45:49 GMT

Hi Again,

I also followed on with the below comments, again I hope they are of help...

Sorry meant to follow on from my previous post......along with the value of winter tyres, driving style should be moderated in accordance with the conditions, no sudden acceleration, turning of the wheel etc along with gentler use of the brakes ( use engine breaking where possible ), with regards to 4x4's the same applies........

......although 4 wheel drive is a massive advantage, a Range Rover ( for eg ) with low profile/normal summer tyres will just become a 2.5 ton sledge if driven normally under the assumption that " it's got 4 wheel drive I can drive normally " ....if you are lucky enough to own a 4x4 some winter rubber at each corner imakes even more sense.

I personnaly think it should be compulsory from the beginning of November to say Mid March in the UK to have winter tyres fitted, the amount of accidents and lives saved would be worth it alone, and less accidents should hopefully mean lower insurance premiums for all.....on a final note in Germany & Switzerland if you are involved in a car accident in the winter and do not have winter tyres fitted.....you are automatically in the wrong regardless of fault.

Peace..

jon.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:12:24 GMT

Dids1 wrote:We also have an automatic Merc.

How would one get round the fact that winter tyres are pointless if the law says you have to have them?

in this country I meant. If it snows I just leave it at home as they don't treat our roads the same way they do abroad.
If you've got an auto Merc and its obligatory to have winter tyres, you have to have them, and whilst it will improve traction etc, its just not a good car to have in snow and ice.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:17:13 GMT

Jon - very good advice.

We saw a large 4X4 on it's side in a ditch in Hemsedal, Norway last season (April). It didn't have norwegian plates - I think it was a dutch or belgian vehicle. Presumably on summer tyres.

We have 4x4 coupled with winter tyres but on an Audi A6 so we don't have the high centre of gravity problem. Best of both world's (other than grim fuel economy!)

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:21:54 GMT

I would like to make a comment about the company mentioned in the link above.

Both myself and a friend had issues when we tried to use them to buy tyres and wheels online a few years ago. They refused to accept a credit card (even though the website accepted it for the order) and contacted us directly to state the card had been declined and to insist we either used a debit card or transferred the money via bacs. I smelt something fishy so pulled out of the order as did my friend, especially as we did not want to lose the protection of using a credit card. Further checks with my credit card revealed they had not even tried to put the charge on it.

After doing further research, I found several stories of people being forced to pay the same way they wanted us to, and then not receiving their orders, either at all or until well into the following season making the order next to useless.

Just want to give people a heads up of how I was treated, that's all.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 17:24:05 GMT

Dids1 wrote:We also have an automatic Merc.

How would one get round the fact that winter tyres are pointless if the law says you have to have them?

Hi Dids we had a Merc which we fitted Nokian wrs, and had no problems worth the investment even in this country for the confidence they will give.
Goff

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 19:34:08 GMT

Far Queue wrote:I would like to make a comment about the company mentioned in the link above.

Both myself and a friend had issues when we tried to use them to buy tyres and wheels online a few years ago. They refused to accept a credit card (even though the website accepted it for the order) and contacted us directly to state the card had been declined and to insist we either used a debit card or transferred the money via bacs. I smelt something fishy so pulled out of the order as did my friend, especially as we did not want to lose the protection of using a credit card. Further checks with my credit card revealed they had not even tried to put the charge on it.

After doing further research, I found several stories of people being forced to pay the same way they wanted us to, and then not receiving their orders, either at all or until well into the following season making the order next to useless.

Just want to give people a heads up of how I was treated, that's all.

Cheers for the heads up....in that case I will use Kwik-Fit, went into see them and they could do the Continental TS800 winter tyres ( 175/70/R14 ) supplied, balanced and fitted for about GBP69 ish, which considering my mileage should last me 3 - 4 seasons.....better than a big insurance claim I think.

Cheers once again

jon.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:22:50 GMT

I bought some winter tyres from Mytyres last October..had no trouble and they were delivered from Germany in 3 days

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:41:25 GMT

Can I ask how you paid for them DaveD? They were very blunt with me, and absolutely insisted I pay by either debit card or bank transfer. The woman on the phone was quite rude, and this was for a sale including wheels, so nearly GBP900 in total.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:52:10 GMT

Our household used MyTyres this summer for a big purchase. No problems with card use or delivery.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 20:58:24 GMT

Fair enough, we have two happy customers and two people who will not go near them again. I only wished to let people know my experience of them. I hope that anyone who uses them gets the level of service that Bandit and Daved seem to have had.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 21:01:47 GMT

I bought my tyres from a local tyre fitter today. I took in a print out from mytyres website and they managed to Get within GBP10 per tyre which was good enough for me.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 21:08:51 GMT

Good one BB, support your local bushinesses. You never know when you will need someone local, worth the slight extra cost I feel.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 21:30:14 GMT

Errk, Bedrock, you just answered the question I asked on another thread! Re tyre source!

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:48:19 GMT

Far Queue wrote:Good one BB, support your local bushinesses. You never know when you will need someone local, worth the slight extra cost I feel.

Spot on. I'd much prefer to put the business locally. The tyre fitters only charge me about GBP12 to swap over the wheels each time. Very reasonable. The owner said he couldn't match the Internet prices but getting within GBP10 per tyre is pretty good when they are apprx GBP150 each.

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Wed, 10 Oct 2012 23:08:14 GMT

I'm looking at GBP171 for All Weather, and GBP190 Winter, this for a Freelander 2. Still looking!

Re:Winter Tyres and Chains

Thu, 11 Oct 2012 07:53:17 GMT

Far Queue wrote:Can I ask how you paid for them DaveD? They were very blunt with me, and absolutely insisted I pay by either debit card or bank transfer. The woman on the phone was quite rude, and this was for a sale including wheels, so nearly GBP900 in total.

As I seem to remember it was debit card online...never spoke to anyone