Latest posts for the topic "Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?"

Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 13:23:49 GMT

Hi all,

Paid my deposit for my regular ski crew's annual ski trip and 2013 we're off to Zug, near Lechs.

Noticed that it's ski out/ski in advertised but the red and black runs back are dotted lines on the piste map indicating, I believe, that the runs are not pisted and patrolled but yet still recognised as runs back to resort.

There are buses back to the hamlet but I'm comfortable skiing the red back (black is apparently interesting) Some of the group may not be as comfortable if they thought it was technically off-piste.
I'm a little confused as to where that leaves us insurance wise - and not keen to just accept the travel agents assessment which is it's fine with regular cover :). Seems to be not quite off-piste but I assume I'll need to get cover for that just in case? And then have to buy extra kit to carry?

Can anyone here put me right please? Cheers :D

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:15:31 GMT

They are itineraries, marked runs but not pisted. The area has loads of them and they are superb.

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 19:57:58 GMT

Just checked the ski map out of curiousity. It looks fantastic!

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 20:12:28 GMT

Worth noting that Red itinerary 33 into Zug is longer than it looks like on the piste map. It's a great run, probably a good one to try.

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 21:13:20 GMT

It is my understanding that these dotted line runs are marked and patrolled pistes that just don't get any attention from piste machines and so remain au natural.

They aren't technically "off-piste"

Any experts out there to corroborate or not this?

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 21:18:01 GMT

OldAndy, I'm no expert but that is exactly what I have been led to believe too.

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 21:53:16 GMT

OldAndy wrote:It is my understanding that these dotted line runs are marked and patrolled pistes that just don't get any attention from piste machines and so remain au natural.

Careful.

The exact definition varies a little but what you're describing sounds more like a "piste nature"; marked, patrolled and avalanche-controlled but just left un-groomed.

An "itinerary" is (a la Verbier), a route marked so you don't get lost/fall off a huge cliff. It's not patrolled or (usually) avalanche-controlled so should be treated as off-piste. I've never skied in Zug but I'd imagine any itinerary around Lech/St.Anton will be "interesting"!

Check locally at the time; some can be so well skied they're as hard-packed as pistes... best be prudent until you know for sure though. 8)

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Tue, 11 Sep 2012 22:10:03 GMT

I googled this, and found 2 articles that said the itinerary routes from Lech to Zug aren't patrolled, and one of them said you should check you are covered by your insurance policy. It does seem to be very confusing :shock:

And then I also found this article in the Telegraph, which is really about avalanches in Lech, but mentions that the itinerary route they are talking about (in the article) isn't patrolled and counts as off-piste.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/snowandski/austria/lech/9104151/Ski-avalanche-accidents-increase-following-record-snow-levels.html

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Wed, 12 Sep 2012 06:29:32 GMT

Can you get insurance with your ski pass? This often coveres rescue in the resort

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Wed, 12 Sep 2012 06:42:13 GMT

So ....
I am confusing itineries with piste naturelle?

Quite a difference from an insurance perspective.

Am I right in thinking that in France itineries are rarely shown on maps but piste naturelle's are dotted whereas in Switzerland itineries are often shown as dotted lines?

Austria?
Italy?

Wish there was a convention to help us all.

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Wed, 12 Sep 2012 12:34:31 GMT

The routes marked with a black dotted line on the periphery of the ski area, including the route back to Zug from the top of the Steinmahder lift are alpine touring routes so there is no obligation for the lift company to implement any safety measures. Some of them have uphill sections.

The shorter routes marked with black and red dotted lines within the ski area are ski routes (Skirouten). Precautions are taken against avalanches, but they are not patrolled. Even though the red route 48 back to Zug is a ski route it is regularly pisted.

http://www.tirol.gv.at/fileadmin/www.tirol.gv.at/themen/sport/berg-und-ski/downloads_berg_und_ski/piste.pdf (German)

In Switzerland precautions are taken against avalanches on itineraries (L'itineraire / Abfahrtsrouten) marked with yellow poles down the middle of the route and marked in yellow on the piste maps, but as in Austria they are not patrolled.

http://www.seilbahnen.org/download.php?file=dcs/users/6/Verkehrssicherungspflicht_06_d.pdf (German)

http://www.seilbahnen.org/download.php?file=dcs/users/6/Obligation_d_assurer_la_securite_06_f.pdf (French)

Bear in mind that often the only avalanche precaution taken on these routes is closure, so if you chose to go down one when it is closed and have an accident you might have issues with your insurance.

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Thu, 13 Sep 2012 13:20:33 GMT

Thanks for all the contributions so far.

I'm looking forward to the trip - looks really good.

So I'm now thinking I just need to make sure of my insurers coverage of 'Skirouten'.

Don#t fancy buying an avalanche pack tbh just because I don't like carting stuff about on the slopes - but I'd rather ski home than have to wait for a bus :lol:

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Sat, 15 Sep 2012 12:45:24 GMT

These are the markers you're looking for:

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Mon, 17 Sep 2012 21:53:42 GMT

The red ski route down into Zug is long but good fun we used it a lot last year. Not tried the black route down yet as I'm still honing my hucking skills lol. Are you staying at the Alpenland? -)

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Wed, 26 Sep 2012 13:14:40 GMT

AlistairS wrote: Are you staying at the Alpenland? -)

We're booked into a different chalet though have registered that one for next time - didn't quite get the number of people this year for various reasons and we like to book out whatever chalet we're in so Alpenland would have been too big this trip.

Bought some new ski pants, goggles on the shopping list. March seems ages away now :-(

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Mon, 28 Jan 2013 18:28:00 GMT

Thought I'd update this - my current insurance covers the dates of the trip but the lad who answered my call (no email contact address) indicated that Skirouten would be covered by insurance 'if the resort considered it safe'

Now emailed them to get that in writing.

All too vague to be honest. Another insurer contacted via email at least went back to their underwriters who considered the run off-piste and therefore requiring a local guide. Not what I wanted to read but at least it's definitive and in writing.

Real pain that there's not one proper piste down to the hamlet really (even a black)

Re:Dotted line on piste maps - off piste?

Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:16:57 GMT

Sounds like you'll be in Furka.

The arlberg area has lots of these ski routes, and they're great fun. No need for avalanche gear, but definitely for competent skiers.