Latest posts for the topic "Private or group??"

Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 00:07:12 GMT

Hi there to all new to this forum so hope we have got our dilemma in the correct place!!

Need some advice about lessons and hoping somebody out there has the answers :-)

We cannot decide whether to book private lessons or group lessons. We are going away during Christmas week as a couple but both ski at slightly different levels.

Although we consider ourselves to be lower intermediate skiers, the other half tends to ski parallel more confidently and more consistently. We want the social side of group lessons but don't want to be put into separate groups. However private lessons are more expensive and less sociable yet they can be tailored more to our individual needs.

As you can see we have little time to make our decision and are racking our brains about what we should do.

Any ideas?

P.S. Anyone else in Andorra at the same time, roughly the same level and fancies joining up for private lessons??

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 00:24:24 GMT

I'd go private - groups are great for getting you started but once your hitting intermediate i think they can tailor things far better to you in a private lesson - take shorter lessons but learn a hell of a lot more 1 on 1 (or 2 on 1).

Plenty of time of time to socialise and make friends on the apres ski.

Anyway, that's my take on it.

Have a great time whatever you do!

Dave

P.S. If your Ski Club Uk members and in a resort where they have a rep then get along there - it's a great way to get the social aspect of group lessons for no extra cost and get the inside track on a resort.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 08:10:17 GMT

I know people, particularly adults, find it hard to go into groups of people they don't know and worry about the standard of other people in the group and then prefer more individual coaching. I think if you really want to learn something though you need to take the plunge and get into a group situation.

The pay-back for taking that plunge is pretty good. In a group situation you've got other people to learn from. Generally people will be making the same mistakes as you and there's a reassurance that you're not the only one finding something difficult. There's actually a benefit from getting small pauses while another member of the group makes an exercise, you get to observe someone else other than a polished instructor and get a chance for a short reflection on what's being taught.

And of course like many things, the more you get involved the more you're going to get out of it, it is fun once you've taken the plunge, you're meeting people who obviously have the same interest as you, there's a social element after the class laughing about the day with new friends over a drink.

If you need one hour for something really specific 1:1 might be interesting but it's often a fallacy that you need it, mostly we construct reasons around a reluctance to put ourselves into the that group situation. By and large you'd find that most professional outdoor training takes place in groups as it's the best learning environment although obviously the networking is a big deal with that.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 08:44:11 GMT

When I started 3 seasons ago, I had group lessons to learn as a beginner. Great fun, everyone in the same boat and all making the same mistakes. Last year, we had a group booking and found that we had advanced quicker than the rest of the group. This lead to a lot of standing around on the hill waiting for those who relied on more attentive instruction to get them down the hill.
For this season we've booked private. Cost wise, for 3 private mornings we're paying the same as we would for 5 group days. Is it worth it? I don't know to be honest. With Swiss Ski School, group lessons were full days so we found we didn't have any time for our own skiing and exploring. Also, you're paying for time the instructor is spending having his/her lunch break.
By going private we get instruction in the morning and then we can use the afternoon to consolidate and explore.

Lots of swings and roundabouts and the decision has to be yours based on what your priorities are. If the social aspect of group learning rates highly then go for that. If like us you want to gain from more personal instruction that is tailored specifically for your skill level then go for the private.

There'll be many diffeent opinions on this one. I asked the same question a few months back.

Whichever you choose, enjoy and make the very best of it.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 09:03:58 GMT

I would suggest private. This will ensure that you can stay together, and also that you both get the instruction that you need as opposed to the class schedule for that week.
If you book an hour or 2 each day, you can then use the free time to practise and get to see more of your resort.
If you take private tuition, you will always be close to your teacher, with group teaching there is always the chance that you will be at the back, keeping up with a procession and unable to see what the teacher is demonstrating.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 09:09:38 GMT

Follow ise's advice and go group :D

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 11:25:07 GMT

This is an interesting debate, and obviously one which people will have differing opinions on. Me, if I was having lessons now I'd go private. If I were starting out as a newbie, I'd go into a group initially.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 11:55:31 GMT

I did not get on with group lessons at all. The age differences in which classes I was put in just did not work for me. Alright we were all complete novices but when you are in a group of 20 year old lads and you are a 50 year old woman the rates at which you learn are different. I would have ended up killing myself trying to keep up with them.
So its private for me I am afraid.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:40:13 GMT

In my family I consider myself an upper level intermediate, my son is a low intermediate becuase he makes up in bravado and enthusiasm what he lacks in skill, my wife and daughter are slightly below him in that they have similar skills but are very cautious. They've skiied twice before in group lessons but as they were school trips they had what were effectively private groups.

This time there's just the four of us going and they're not yet ready to ski without instruction, I'm not good enough to teach them and they don't want to be in public group lessons on their own :roll:

I've decided to go for a mixture this time; I've prebooked group lessons for three days which I figure will warm us up and get us used to the piste area then we will ski as a family for the remaining three days and possibly book a private lesson or two to polish up on specific aspects.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:37:59 GMT

There are pros and cons to both, but for the level you are at, I'd edge toward 2 or 3 half-day private lessons. You'll get an instructor who's watching you ski and suggesting where improvements can be made, rather than with a group where you might spend time practising things you are already good at.
You should progress faster with private lessons because there is far more focus on you.
The rest of the time you can get the miles under your skis, practise, practise, practise.

Re:Private or group??

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 23:05:57 GMT

I am with Ise on this. There are many benefits to be had with the group situation.

However, I would raise the issue that if your main criteria is to maximise the learning potential for each of you, then lose the criteria that you should be in the same classes.

Like many other walks of life, ski learning comes in flashes, feelings, "I've got it" moments. We trudge painstakingly forwards, then jump to a new plateau of knowledge. These moments will not routinely happen together.

If your criteria is to stay in the same class, then you may each be holding the other back. It may be that you are in the same class by right, but that would be a bonus. A good ski school will, on occasion, offer to move it's people up and across between classes, should that be a benefit to the individual.

We are going at New Yaer with a couple of beginners. They have both completed a month of dry slope, and this will be of benefit. Already, there is a gap opening in their comparitive abilities. I have suggested they do not attach any importance to having lessons in the same group, and they have understood and accepted it.

I am of the opinion that one of them wll be skiing the mountain by around the fourth or fifth day, and the other one will will have to wait for another year. But after three or four years of learning, none of that will matter.

Then go free skiing together, and with others.

Re:Private or group??

Mon, 8 Dec 2008 08:02:08 GMT

RoseR wrote:I did not get on with group lessons at all. The age differences in which classes I was put in just did not work for me. Alright we were all complete novices but when you are in a group of 20 year old lads and you are a 50 year old woman the rates at which you learn are different. I would have ended up killing myself trying to keep up with them.
So its private for me I am afraid.

I did some of my BASI training with people in their late teens, they weren't even close to me in terms of fitness, they tired too quickly and had no stamina at all so it's all relative.

Re:Private or group??

Mon, 8 Dec 2008 08:24:51 GMT

ise wrote:

RoseR wrote:I did not get on with group lessons at all. The age differences in which classes I was put in just did not work for me. Alright we were all complete novices but when you are in a group of 20 year old lads and you are a 50 year old woman the rates at which you learn are different. I would have ended up killing myself trying to keep up with them.
So its private for me I am afraid.

I did some of my BASI training with people in their late teens, they weren't even close to me in terms of fitness, they tired too quickly and had no stamina at all so it's all relative.

I agree with ise and must make the point that the instructor should go at your pace not that of the "fastest" and if he feels that a member of the class is so out of step with the rest he should move them not keep up with them to the detriment of the others

Re:Private or group??

Mon, 8 Dec 2008 08:37:48 GMT

daved wrote:

I agree with ise and must make the point that the instructor should go at your pace not that of the "fastest" and if he feels that a member of the class is so out of step with the rest he should move them not keep up with them to the detriment of the others

yes, it's not good to compare a bad group lesson with a good 1:1, with group size I'm thinking of things with not more than 6 or 8 people, that's about critical mass to get some good feedback loops in and not so big to lose individual contact.

My opinion on this has altered over the years, looking back I can recall some fairly weak rationalisations to cover a basic reluctance to get into a group. Nowadays I've no choice the CPD and training I have to do is always in a group setting and there's really no doubt this is a better learning environment, if you want the jargon this is a collaborative learning environment and that's what I'm talking about.

The biggest fallacy is that we've all got some sort of unique issue, by and large we all struggle with the same or similar stuff, just getting into a group and recognising that is part way to fixing it.

Private or group??

Mon, 8 Dec 2008 08:48:24 GMT

Having taught private lessons for over 30 years in both Colorado and in France (Megeve), your question is a very good one.
The question comes down to cost, return on investment, personal dedication, and the choice of ski instructors.

To get spot on professional error correction there is nothing that is more immediate than a private lesson. Go for a minimum of two to three hours.

Class lessons will be less targeted to the individual. Make sure to choose an instructor that has a philosophy of just not skiing in front of the group all the time.

Once you have found an instructor (Class or Private) that is giving you what you are looking for in the way of quality attention and tips, comments... make sure to book him/her again.

How to find an instructor... look on the hill while your skiing if you see one that is teaching in a way that pleases and could satisfy your needs (you can follow him and his lesson for a while) go over and introduce yourself and get his card !

We at www.SkiProsMegeve.com teach only private and small corporate groups. We reserve up to a year in advance.

I hope this helped,
Megeve Mike

Re:Private or group??

Mon, 8 Dec 2008 08:58:06 GMT

I tend to go female, they always seem to be the best instructors. :wink:

Re:Private or group??

Mon, 8 Dec 2008 20:58:47 GMT

Wow! That's the last time I write what I thought was a straight forward question on a forum and not look at it again for a couple of days!

I don't feel quite so bad that we are having such a tough time deciding what to do about lessons judging by the divided opinions on this topic.

Annoyingly though we can understand and even agree with both sides on some points which makes our decision even more frustrating to make :shock:

Still got two weeks so hopefully we will have a light bulb moment before then :)

Thanks for all your responses!

Re:Private or group??

Tue, 9 Dec 2008 11:39:12 GMT

pigski wrote:Wow! That's the last time I write what I thought was a straight forward question on a forum and not look at it again for a couple of days!

I don't feel quite so bad that we are having such a tough time deciding what to do about lessons judging by the divided opinions on this topic.

Annoyingly though we can understand and even agree with both sides on some points which makes our decision even more frustrating to make :shock:

Still got two weeks so hopefully we will have a light bulb moment before then :)

Thanks for all your responses!

I think if you read it you see consensus around the main stuff, get a good instructor on a recommendation (like Mikeskifrance whom I know by reputation from when we were in St Gervais), groups can be good but only small ones and .. er... well that's probably good enough really.