Latest posts for the topic "using a drag lift"

using a drag lift

jaycraig — GMT

I am writing this reference to my wife as i cannot help her! We both began skiing together and both are what i like to think fairly competent skiiers both confident using red runs and thinking of using black runs on a more regular basis.However my wife cannot use a draglift and keeps loosing control of her skis and falling off. The problem is that i can use them and find them no problem but cant explain to her how to use them because the truth is i dont really know myself i just get on and go so i dont really know what i am doing right and she is doing wrong. The point of this thread is that i was hoping some kind soul will explain how to use them as it is getting to a stage where she will not consider going somewhere without the majority of lifts being gondolas or chairlifts so she can completely avoid having to use them thanks for your time jay

Re:using a drag lift

bandit — GMT

Oooh, I hope someone who is a ski teacher will be able to explain some tips for you to pass on. Is this problem on single Poma's or T-bar lifts as well?

using a drag lift

Trencher — GMT

jaycraig wrote:

The point of this thread is that i was hoping some kind soul will explain how to use them as it is getting to a stage where she will not consider going somewhere without the majority of lifts being gondolas or chairlifts so she can completely avoid having to use them jay

It never ceases to amaze me that there are so many long drag lifts in Europe. This is the 21st century. As pav keeps saying, complain. You go to a resort to ski, not to expend your energy on drag lifts. Going up should be the time to recover, relax and talk to friends in comfort. Even if you are very very good on a drag lift, it's hardly a relaxing experience. I would say, go somewhere else and have a more relaxing time. Trencher

Re:using a drag lift

Jan I Stenmark — GMT

Hi jaycraig, A very interesting question! Have you every been told NOT to think of Pink Elephants? Well of course you haven't but if you were, the chances are that the very thing you would think of are ... Pink Elephants! Now when I'm teaching people to use a tow lift (T-Bar, Poma or whathaveyou) the most important instruction I give is "Stand-Up!" the temptation as an instructor is to say "Don't sit down" but that brings us back to our elephants ... Many, MANY people who are new to drag lifts seem to think (or at least presume) that the lift will do the work. Well that's true in as much as it will "drag" you up the hill but it will never take control of your route or posture. That remains firmly with the user. As you are happy using Red runs you should be familliar with the concept of a neautral posture ... Upright with ankles, knees and hips gently flexed and with your weight over the centre of your feet. This is exactly the same posture that is needed on a drag lift ... If you lean WAY back and hope the lift will somehow support you, you will very soon find youself on the floor. Equally, if you overweight the front of your skis they will snake about wildly and will probably unseat you ... So, stand up, be neutral, and take control of your skis as if you were skiing down the hill ... Please let us know if this helps! Cheers Jan

Re:using a drag lift

Tony_H — GMT

I was never taught how to get on a drag. I dont even think about it when I do, apart from obviously not leaning backwards. I would imagine its just a mental block, and that she actually has the right technique, as she is obviously a good enough skier. Cant really help, other than suggest you chuck her on a few and keep trying. Or else make her wait at the bottom for you to ski down. I bet she tries harder then.....

Re:using a drag lift

Trencher — GMT

Tony_H wrote:

Cant really help, other than suggest you chuck her on a few and keep trying. Or else make her wait at the bottom for you to ski down. I bet she tries harder then.....

or puts the kibosh on the next ski holiday....Majorca anyone ? Trencher

using a drag lift

ise — GMT

Trencher wrote:

jaycraig wrote:

The point of this thread is that i was hoping some kind soul will explain how to use them as it is getting to a stage where she will not consider going somewhere without the majority of lifts being gondolas or chairlifts so she can completely avoid having to use them jay
It never ceases to amaze me that there are so many long drag lifts in Europe. This is the 21st century. As pav keeps saying, complain. You go to a resort to ski, not to expend your energy on drag lifts. Going up should be the time to recover, relax and talk to friends in comfort. Even if you are very very good on a drag lift, it's hardly a relaxing experience. I would say, go somewhere else and have a more relaxing time. Trencher

Surface lifts are often used in places where pylons for aerial lifts can't be installed like glaciers for example or where they'd be susceptible to wind or where low amounts of traffic make them more effective and efficient.

using a drag lift

Trencher — GMT

ise wrote:

Surface lifts are often used in places where pylons for aerial lifts can't be installed like glaciers for example or where they'd be susceptible to wind or where low amounts of traffic make them more effective and efficient.

Ise, what percentage of drag lifts do you think would fit the circumstances you mention ?. It's very easy for me to get the impression that drag lift are wide spread. Every other Euro skiing video I see on utube has a drag lift in the background. Trencher

Re:using a drag lift

jaycraig — GMT

Thanks jan i think you have cracked the problem! What you described about the skis snaking wildly is exactly what is happening so i think she is leaning forward as though you are taught to ski down a hill. Many thanks you have possibly saved my skiing life!!!

using a drag lift

ise — GMT

Trencher wrote:

ise wrote:

Surface lifts are often used in places where pylons for aerial lifts can't be installed like glaciers for example or where they'd be susceptible to wind or where low amounts of traffic make them more effective and efficient.
Ise, what percentage of drag lifts do you think would fit the circumstances you mention ?. It's very easy for me to get the impression that drag lift are wide spread. Every other Euro skiing video I see on utube has a drag lift in the background. Trencher

100% obviously ) What percentage of that is purely where they're more efficient is a more interesting question, that's going to be over 50% I'd bet.

Re:using a drag lift

Dave Mac — GMT

I agree the percentage of tee bars is too high, but that is not going to answer this lady's problem. Jan is right, "Stand up", and "Strong legs" The sitting down is a reaction to the T bar pull. Don't react. And this leads me to another story.... We are at the bottom of the beginners slope in Niederau, (back in the early mists of time) I am skis off, helping the lift man to load my class onto their first T bar. Three times this rather over-buxom lady, (we are talking over 14stone, 90kgm) fell off, before I signalled to the lift man. A big grin went round the other instructors, they knew what was coming. I jumped onto my skis, positioned on the left, and when the bar went between us, grabbed her round the waist, and hoisted her up off the snow. We arrived at the top, sweat pouring from everywhere, before I gently deposited her off to one side, and tried to pretend that this was quite a normal part of teaching. To be fair, every one of the instructors at the bottom bought me a beer. Another contributary factor to the dodgy knee...

Re:using a drag lift

fft100 — GMT

nice to know that i am not the only one who has problems with drags. been skiing for quite a few years and still crap though reds arent a problem, but have to admit to scanning piste maps before i start in the morning to try to make sure i dont end up in a dead end where there are no options except for a drag lift. And until you see the drag, its not always possible to know just what its level of difficulty is going to be. some of them could feature in a channel 4 series. The ones that go up 45 degree slopes on small tracks with severe drops and then change directions whilst going downhill just give me the pure w*ll**s. Have fallen off in places which i would rather not think about....

Re:Why Drag ( T-bars)!

pavelski — GMT

It often is the simple questions that cause much discussion! There are three basic reasons for such "lifts"! 1. Economic Many of the European centers are local/village type centers! it costs much less to have such lifts! 2.Many such lifts are in the high plateau/peak areas of skiing again cost is factor but also ecological impact! 3. In high "avalanch" areas it is better to have such lifts, since rebuilding pulley type system is much easier and cheaper! If you ever ski Fernie Ski Resort, there is a T-bar lift that every year gets ripped away by avalanche. In fact the top anchor posts and pulley system are designed to release from base! In Fall a new system is place!

Re:Why Drag ( T-bars)!

ise — GMT

pavelski wrote:

It often is the simple questions that cause much discussion! There are three basic reasons for such "lifts"! 1. Economic Many of the European centers are local/village type centers! it costs much less to have such lifts!

pavelski wrote:

2.Many such lifts are in the high plateau/peak areas of skiing again cost is factor but also ecological impact!

the impact of a ground lift is far higher in ecological terms, they disturb the local flora and fauna, that's why you see chamois or ibex under aerial lifts and not strolling along side you on a drag lift.

pavelski wrote:

3. In high "avalanch" areas it is better to have such lifts, since rebuilding pulley type system is much easier and cheaper! If you ever ski Fernie Ski Resort, there is a T-bar lift that every year gets ripped away by avalanche. In fact the top anchor posts and pulley system are designed to release from base! In Fall a new system is place!

that might be true in Fernie, although I doubt it really, in the rest of the world lifts are protected from avalanche risk, less people die that way. Aerial lifts are much safer, pylons can be placed at safe distance in islands of safety with spans extending over any terrain traps.

Re:using a drag lift

Trencher — GMT

http://www.avalanche.org/proc-show.php3?OID=5406924 You never know Trencher

Re:using a drag lift

ise — GMT

Trencher wrote:

http://www.avalanche.org/proc-show.php3?OID=5406924 You never know Trencher

Interesting incident, more so because it was inbounds as I read the report. Was it you who commented a while back inbounds incidents were on the increase?

Re:using a drag lift

Trencher — GMT

ise wrote:

Interesting incident, more so because it was inbounds as I read the report. Was it you who commented a while back inbounds incidents were on the increase?

It was one of several inbounds fatalities that year. In that incident I read a few comments that the wind caused by the avalanche might have dislodged the kid from the chair. Trencher

Re:using a drag lift

ise — GMT

Trencher wrote:

ise wrote:

Interesting incident, more so because it was inbounds as I read the report. Was it you who commented a while back inbounds incidents were on the increase?
It was one of several inbounds fatalities that year. In that incident I read a few comments that the wind caused by the avalanche might have dislodged the kid from the chair. Trencher

IIRC, that was the official verdict from the report, i.e. the air-blast dislodged him. What I don't recall though is was the chair-lift equipped with safety bars and were they in use? It all sounded rather avoidable sadly.

Re:using a drag lift

Jan I Stenmark — GMT

Perhaps just to lighten the mood I would like to make a small comment in support of the humble drag lift. How often do we hear "experts" extolling us to warm-up before setting off at the beginning of the day? But how many repeat the warning about dismounting from Cablecars, Gondolas, or chairs? I find that using a "surface lift" keeps me just warm enough that additional warmups are not required whilst a long journey up in/on a non-surface lift often leaves me cold and stiff. From the point of view of continued warmth I would like to vote for surface lifts. Additionally the use of a drag gives many people the chance to "stretch-out" tight legs and re-establish blood flow to cold feet. Perhaps for those who only get a few days skiing per year the chance to get some "free" fitness training may be more valuable than the comfort of a chair ... I'd also mention that a resort with a high level of surface lifts is unlikely to attract a high percentage of snow-boarders ... Don't know what that matters but I thought I'd mention it :) Jan

Re:using a drag lift

Trencher — GMT

Jan I Stenmark wrote:

Perhaps for those who only get a few days skiing per year the chance to get some "free" fitness training may be more valuable than the comfort of a chair ... I'd also mention that a resort with a high level of surface lifts is unlikely to attract a high percentage of snow-boarders ... Don't know what that matters but I thought I'd mention it :) Jan

I'm reasonably fit, but I still hate to expend energy going up the hill. I've mentioned in the past that my local little ski hill has put more people on the US ski team than any other place. Locals attribute this to the high speed rope tow that is on the slalom run. It goes three times as fast as the chair lift. and kids training will go up it 30/40 times a session. It is said to give them thighs like tree trunks. When that run is open and my short memory forgets, I've gone up that rope tow. You get to the top and and your thighs are burning, abs aching, and arms feel stretched. I normally have to catch my breath befor starting down. Try it on a snowboard and your eyes are watering halfway up from the discomfort. Trencher

Re:using a drag lift

bandit — GMT

Jan I Stenmark wrote:

Perhaps for those who only get a few days skiing per year the chance to get some "free" fitness training may be more valuable than the comfort of a chair ... Jan

When I read this comment, I thought you were extolling the virtues of skinning up the slopes :lol: Now that is a really good way to get fit, probably slightly higher calorie burn than a drag lift :D

Re:using a drag lift

Wanderer — GMT

Generally, I try to avoid drags. Like some of the other posters, I prefer to use my energy skiing. My aversion to them also has to do with a bad experience the first time I went skiing. Half way up a rarely used drag with a poor surface, I fell off and was left in the middle of nowhere with no way down. Luckily a kind stranger jumped off and gave me directions to a blue slope nearby. On the other hand....... a few years ago on a bad weather day with high winds in Meribel, virtually all the chairs and gondolas were closed and most people were just giving up. A couple of us went ski guiding with the Crystal rep - he knew all the drags and we were able to ski virtually the entire area in fresh snow with almost nobody on the mountain. It was a fantastic ski day against the odds and all due to the availability of drags. On balance, I still don't particularly like them but they can have their uses!